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I'm not saying he's an elite QB. Just that he has elite attributes that stand out in a big way even amongst his peers (eye manipulation and quick reads).

Tough to find many All-22 gifs but here's some examples.

Watch Mariota and watch #50. He's still staring him down as he begins to release the ball.



Watch what Mariota does to #43 here. Again, isn't even looking at his target until he's into his release. This is the "crossover" element Mariota's eyes bring to the game.



Mariota sets up the crossing route and throws it downfield just as he's able to chase the safety out of his window. This is almost like a read option play where you read the defensive end before handing the ball off or taking it. Mariota has a millisecond to decide whether he's throwing the crosser or to Walker downfield. First half of his motion suggests he's going to the crosser. But just as the safety starts to run through the passing lane (like an option QB setting up the DE before making his decision) he spontaneously goes to his downfield read, made easier by his eyes keeping #49 in the box. All happens so quickly, it's tough to appreciate everything that goes into a play like this.

The tight end fades out of the picture but that's who Mariota is locked in right before he throws a TD to his receiver. Goes through all four of his reads very quickly.



Here Mariota gives every indication he's dumping it off to his TE Delanie Walker, sees the linebacker drawn into Walker's area, and spontaneously rips the ball downfield to his WR. Body position on the throw still awkward from such a quick adjustment so he loses some accuracy but his WR makes a play.



Stealing candy from a baby on this play. #56 caught in no man's land, Mariota needs him to vacate that window so he very quickly turns to Murray before firing the ball over the middle through the space #56 just vacated. Mariota's eyes break linebacker ankles.



Quick fakes like he's throwing to his running back. This draws #50 out of the play so Mariota can throw a TD into the window he just vacated. All in the eyes, boys.

Reign in Blood wrote:I guess I'm too much of a casual fan, because I don't see any of that shit with Mariota. I like the kid, don't see him being the next coming of Luck, in which I didn't see being that great to begin with.

True, you laughed at the idea of us jettisoning Tebow for Luck when I was on the Suck for Luck train. :oops:

I'd say four years of Peyton made it worth it.

I love the perspective of these gifs because you see exactly what the QB sees (at least the ones facing the defense). You get a close look at the mental battle between a QB and linebackers/safeties. It's impossible to see this shit from regular TV angles. Incredibly valuable for looking at quarterbacks.

I interpret the first few GIFs as Mariota simply waiting for his first read to open. His head doesn't move often, it doesn't mean he's looking down a defender. But he has still made some amazing plays, as listed in the GIFs you posted. In addition to that, he makes some totally bizarre throws and tries to fit it in windows that are already closed the moment the ball is released from his hand.

I also don't want to sound like I'm trying to diminish him. I am a fan, and rooting for the guy.

It doesn't matter whether or not it's his first read, he excels at setting up defenders to move to the areas of the field that benefit him by selling other reads. He is absolutely baiting the defenders in all of these. In the first gif, he sees his TE in the same lane as #50 and sells that hard rollout to the left to get away from pressure, the LB is mirroring him. But instead he plants and drives the throw in the opposite direction to the LB's motion. It's not the progressions that matter, although he does so incredibly quickly, it's the way he manipulates defenders into giving him open passing lanes.

I would concede, but I have seen him probably a dozen times laser focused on a receiver only to throw it directly into the zone defender standing in front of him. He does that way too often for me to believe he is even close to a master manipulator of zone defenders. It could even be that he got lucky and didn't even see the defender in half these GIFs, we really don't truly know. I want to see more from him before bowing down. He has been scary inconsistent so far. But when he's on, he's on.

He does still make too many mistakes and sometimes he gets too tricky. But this doesn't change the fact that his raw ability to move defenders is special, as good as it gets. If anything he doesn't use his eyes enough, gets lazy in his technique and forces it to receivers the defense has keyed on. And no, he's not getting "lucky" in these gifs, he gets the defender to go exactly where he wants every time. That's a crazy skill and you shouldn't knock it.

I'm not bowing down. He's a really fun player who will get better and better. The way he crosses up defenders with his eyes is awesome to see. That's all.

That's a tremendous skill, but I want to be sure it's actually happening before I heap praise. I would buy into it completely if he wasn't totally blind on a lot of his throws. I just have a hard time believing a master manipulator of zone defenders doesn't even see the zone defender on many of his throws. I'm waiting until next year to form an opinion.

Who is their QB coach? Didn't they just promote a guy this year or last year?

What you're talking about is consistency. I'm talking about raw talent. He makes a lot of mistakes, yes. I'm talking about the ability he's shown to move defenders all over the field. I've seen him do that as well as you can hope for from a QB at times. You can see it in these gifs. I don't need him to never make a mistake to know he's capable of doing it at the highest level. He's still improving his craft everywhere, the consistency will come.

Jason wrote:Who is their QB coach? Didn't they just promote a guy this year or last year?

Jason Michael...never heard of him.

Like I said, I'm waiting until at least next year to form an opinion. Winston is the only young QB (and Carr, I reckon) that has me convinced he is the real deal, and will be for some time. I also fear Winston will be the last great deep ball thrower the NFL will see. Moving into dink and dunk seems to be the future of football.

Headhunter wrote:

Jason wrote:Who is their QB coach? Didn't they just promote a guy this year or last year?

Jason Michael...never heard of him.

Good ol' Friday Halloween.

I've heard of him. All I know is he is young. Not even the slightest clue what he's capable of as a coach.

Jameis is a joy to watch but he really has a ways to go before that deep ball is a consistent threat. He frequently overthrows/goes high and he'll have brain fart misses where nobody is even around the ball but a defender or two. Mike Evans is a 6'5" monster and too often doesn't have a chance to make a play on the ball. In general Winston needs to sharpen up his accuracy in every area, because outside of those inconsistencies he's a damn near perfect QB prospect. Love his game.

It will be interesting to see how that deep ball progresses. Because DeSean will be open downfield at least once a game.

Some of the fucking throws Derek Carr is capable of making are just jaw dropping.

Gross. y u post that Raider shit? I'd rather see Elway in here. :p






I was also shocked to learn that Elway actually played his entire NFL career with an unrepaired torn ACL that he blew out in high school.

It's fucking amazing how much zip is still on that ball by the time it gets to Shannon.