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Foo wrote:

zombie wrote:

Foo wrote:

Dream wrote:I would support a historical monument of Lee if if commemorated his thoughts about being American post-Civil War, because his own beliefs were that he, nor any other Confederate soldiers, generals, etc, should be held up in high regard because it is simply keeping old wounds open and allowing them to fester. He wanted to bring the country back together after the war and treat it as a truly united country, not a south vs north indefinitely. He would be appalled at the idea of the statue even existing. It does nothing but cause divisiveness and remind people of the hatred, which was exactly what he didn't want to happen post-war.

Should we also wipe Martin Luther King, Rosa Parks, etc. from monuments and street bands because it reminds us of a worse time and opens wounds?

These attempts to cleanse history are disturbing. We build monuments to be lasting reminders for good reason. Tearing them down is the act of a foreign invasion. "Forget how you got here and those that made the sacrifices in the past, we are your new heroes. Have a cookie."

read through a post before you quote it, and try to push your narrative?

I did. I object to the statue causing nothing but divisiveness. The people causing divisiveness are those who want to take it down.

If I walk into a a black community and start a process to take down a Martin Luther King statue, is the statue the problem?

fine, twist it to push your narrative. i'll bite. no, the statue is not the problem at any time. it's just a representation of what ideas and beliefs you put onto it, as a culture and society.

So is the narrative that anyone associated with the confederacy is scum? I thought Robert E. Lee was a well respected General even though he was on the losing side of the war.

Reign in Blood wrote:So is the narrative that anyone associated with the confederacy is scum? I thought Robert E. Lee was a well respected General even though he was on the losing side of the war.

Of course not. It's that the confederacy itself and those who fought for it, however innocently and without being white land owning slave owners, are not worthy of monuments as they fought for oppression and slavery. The people may be lively after, as it seems Lee was judging by Dresms very interesting post. But the monument isn't for the man, anymore, but for the ideals he represented.

showa58taro wrote:

Reign in Blood wrote:So is the narrative that anyone associated with the confederacy is scum? I thought Robert E. Lee was a well respected General even though he was on the losing side of the war.

Of course not. It's that the confederacy itself and those who fought for it, however innocently and without being white land owning slave owners, are not worthy of monuments as they fought for oppression and slavery. The people may be lively after, as it seems Lee was judging by Dresms very interesting post. But the monument isn't for the man, anymore, but for the ideals he represented.

So like revisionist history, as we (d)evolve we're gonna pick and choose shit? That's fine. I grew up thinking nothing more of Lee than the general of the war, neither here nor there. Lincoln is regarded as one of our best presidents, but my Dad hated him for killing his own countrymen. I'm not looking to tear down either monument because of their ideals or outcome, but we're in a brave new world. SJWs running wild.

No, revisionist history is when people fron the South claim the war was about states' rights or some other such bullshit. Why do we need to cater to their delusions?

Reign in Blood wrote:So is the narrative that anyone associated with the confederacy is scum? I thought Robert E. Lee was a well respected General even though he was on the losing side of the war.

Literally no one said that . . .

Anyone but Foo want to pretend these monuments aren't seen as symbols of racial hatred? People who came to Charlottesville didn't give a fuck about Robert E. Lee, they cared about the racism and hatred associated with the Confederacy. Why would neo-Nazis care so much? This isn't about Robert E. Lee. Wake the fuck up people.

Headhunter wrote:

Reign in Blood wrote:So is the narrative that anyone associated with the confederacy is scum? I thought Robert E. Lee was a well respected General even though he was on the losing side of the war.

Literally no one said that . . .

I was only asking...

Foo wrote:

zombie wrote:

Foo wrote:

Dream wrote:I would support a historical monument of Lee if if commemorated his thoughts about being American post-Civil War, because his own beliefs were that he, nor any other Confederate soldiers, generals, etc, should be held up in high regard because it is simply keeping old wounds open and allowing them to fester. He wanted to bring the country back together after the war and treat it as a truly united country, not a south vs north indefinitely. He would be appalled at the idea of the statue even existing. It does nothing but cause divisiveness and remind people of the hatred, which was exactly what he didn't want to happen post-war.

Should we also wipe Martin Luther King, Rosa Parks, etc. from monuments and street bands because it reminds us of a worse time and opens wounds?

These attempts to cleanse history are disturbing. We build monuments to be lasting reminders for good reason. Tearing them down is the act of a foreign invasion. "Forget how you got here and those that made the sacrifices in the past, we are your new heroes. Have a cookie."

read through a post before you quote it, and try to push your narrative?

I did. I object to the statue causing nothing but divisiveness. The people causing divisiveness are those who want to take it down.

If I walk into a a black community and start a process to take down a Martin Luther King statue, is the statue the problem?

When did the black community oppress white America for centuries? These analogies are so awful.

Headhunter wrote:Anyone but Foo want to pretend these monuments aren't seen as symbols of racial hatred? People who came to Charlottesville didn't give a fuck about Robert E. Lee, they cared about the racism and hatred associated with the Confederacy. Why would neo-Nazis care so much? This isn't about Robert E. Lee. Wake the fuck up people.

Why all the hate now?

Reign in Blood wrote:

Headhunter wrote:

Reign in Blood wrote:So is the narrative that anyone associated with the confederacy is scum? I thought Robert E. Lee was a well respected General even though he was on the losing side of the war.

Literally no one said that . . .

I was only asking...

The Confederate generals and soldiers deserve our pity. Not our celebration nor disgust. People should view the CSA with contempt for wasting so many lives just to cater to the insecurities of the wealthiest class of landowners. Sad, really.

Headhunter wrote:Anyone but Foo want to pretend these monuments aren't seen as symbols of racial hatred? People who came to Charlottesville didn't give a fuck about Robert E. Lee, they cared about the racism and hatred associated with the Confederacy. Why would neo-Nazis care so much? This isn't about Robert E. Lee. Wake the fuck up people.

the monuments are not the problem. the ideas that people associate with them is the problem. see a statue of walt disney.. you could think back to childhood, enjoyment of films he helped to create. or you could see it as representing the dumbing down of american youth. or you could just mistake him for vincent price. it's on you, not the statue.

i'm not into censorship. and i'm not into telling other people what that symbol represents to them. if you don't like it, move on. if you like it for bad reasons, then you're the problem. you should be dealt with. but it's not the statue that caused it, it's your bias and fucked upness.

Reign in Blood wrote:

Headhunter wrote:Anyone but Foo want to pretend these monuments aren't seen as symbols of racial hatred? People who came to Charlottesville didn't give a fuck about Robert E. Lee, they cared about the racism and hatred associated with the Confederacy. Why would neo-Nazis care so much? This isn't about Robert E. Lee. Wake the fuck up people.

Why all the hate now?

What do you think? Seriously take a look at some pictures of Charlottesville and try to convince yourself they're upset about the removal of a statue, and have no alterior motives. They're chanting "Blood and soil", "Jews will not replace us" and other hateful garbage while goose stepping through the streets. That's not regional pride.

zombie wrote:

Headhunter wrote:Anyone but Foo want to pretend these monuments aren't seen as symbols of racial hatred? People who came to Charlottesville didn't give a fuck about Robert E. Lee, they cared about the racism and hatred associated with the Confederacy. Why would neo-Nazis care so much? This isn't about Robert E. Lee. Wake the fuck up people.

the monuments are not the problem. the ideas that people associate with them is the problem. see a statue of walt disney.. you could think back to childhood, enjoyment of films he helped to create. or you could see it as representing the dumbing down of american youth. or you could just mistake him for vincent price. it's on you, not the statue.

i'm not into censorship. and i'm not into telling other people what that symbol represents to them. if you don't like it, move on. if you like it for bad reasons, then you're the problem. you should be dealt with. but it's not the statue that caused it, it's your bias and fucked upness.

It's easy to say that and not be black though. Neither of us could understand that.

Headhunter wrote:

Reign in Blood wrote:

Headhunter wrote:Anyone but Foo want to pretend these monuments aren't seen as symbols of racial hatred? People who came to Charlottesville didn't give a fuck about Robert E. Lee, they cared about the racism and hatred associated with the Confederacy. Why would neo-Nazis care so much? This isn't about Robert E. Lee. Wake the fuck up people.

Why all the hate now?

What do you think? Seriously take a look at some pictures of Charlottesville and try to convince yourself they're upset about the removal of a statue, and have no alterior motives. They're chanting "Blood and soil", "Jews will not replace us" and other hateful garbage while goose stepping through the streets. That's not regional pride.

Why is the removal of the statue happening?

Headhunter wrote:

zombie wrote:

Headhunter wrote:Anyone but Foo want to pretend these monuments aren't seen as symbols of racial hatred? People who came to Charlottesville didn't give a fuck about Robert E. Lee, they cared about the racism and hatred associated with the Confederacy. Why would neo-Nazis care so much? This isn't about Robert E. Lee. Wake the fuck up people.

the monuments are not the problem. the ideas that people associate with them is the problem. see a statue of walt disney.. you could think back to childhood, enjoyment of films he helped to create. or you could see it as representing the dumbing down of american youth. or you could just mistake him for vincent price. it's on you, not the statue.

i'm not into censorship. and i'm not into telling other people what that symbol represents to them. if you don't like it, move on. if you like it for bad reasons, then you're the problem. you should be dealt with. but it's not the statue that caused it, it's your bias and fucked upness.

It's easy to say that and not be black though. Neither of us could understand that.

Don't breathe the air, zombs.

Headhunter wrote:

zombie wrote:

Headhunter wrote:Anyone but Foo want to pretend these monuments aren't seen as symbols of racial hatred? People who came to Charlottesville didn't give a fuck about Robert E. Lee, they cared about the racism and hatred associated with the Confederacy. Why would neo-Nazis care so much? This isn't about Robert E. Lee. Wake the fuck up people.

the monuments are not the problem. the ideas that people associate with them is the problem. see a statue of walt disney.. you could think back to childhood, enjoyment of films he helped to create. or you could see it as representing the dumbing down of american youth. or you could just mistake him for vincent price. it's on you, not the statue.

i'm not into censorship. and i'm not into telling other people what that symbol represents to them. if you don't like it, move on. if you like it for bad reasons, then you're the problem. you should be dealt with. but it's not the statue that caused it, it's your bias and fucked upness.

It's easy to say that and not be black though. Neither of us could understand that.

no, i don't have that struggle or that history. but it still comes down to what they see into the statue.

Reign in Blood wrote:

Headhunter wrote:

Reign in Blood wrote:

Headhunter wrote:Anyone but Foo want to pretend these monuments aren't seen as symbols of racial hatred? People who came to Charlottesville didn't give a fuck about Robert E. Lee, they cared about the racism and hatred associated with the Confederacy. Why would neo-Nazis care so much? This isn't about Robert E. Lee. Wake the fuck up people.

Why all the hate now?

What do you think? Seriously take a look at some pictures of Charlottesville and try to convince yourself they're upset about the removal of a statue, and have no alterior motives. They're chanting "Blood and soil", "Jews will not replace us" and other hateful garbage while goose stepping through the streets. That's not regional pride.

Why is the removal of the statue happening?

Most view it as a symbol of hatred and oppression. As confirmed by the people who showed up to protest its removal.

zombie wrote:

Headhunter wrote:

zombie wrote:

Headhunter wrote:Anyone but Foo want to pretend these monuments aren't seen as symbols of racial hatred? People who came to Charlottesville didn't give a fuck about Robert E. Lee, they cared about the racism and hatred associated with the Confederacy. Why would neo-Nazis care so much? This isn't about Robert E. Lee. Wake the fuck up people.

the monuments are not the problem. the ideas that people associate with them is the problem. see a statue of walt disney.. you could think back to childhood, enjoyment of films he helped to create. or you could see it as representing the dumbing down of american youth. or you could just mistake him for vincent price. it's on you, not the statue.

i'm not into censorship. and i'm not into telling other people what that symbol represents to them. if you don't like it, move on. if you like it for bad reasons, then you're the problem. you should be dealt with. but it's not the statue that caused it, it's your bias and fucked upness.

It's easy to say that and not be black though. Neither of us could understand that.

no, i don't have that struggle or that history. but it still comes down to what they see into the statue.

What else could they possibly see? Give me a spin zone here.

Headhunter wrote:

Reign in Blood wrote:

Headhunter wrote:

Reign in Blood wrote:

Headhunter wrote:Anyone but Foo want to pretend these monuments aren't seen as symbols of racial hatred? People who came to Charlottesville didn't give a fuck about Robert E. Lee, they cared about the racism and hatred associated with the Confederacy. Why would neo-Nazis care so much? This isn't about Robert E. Lee. Wake the fuck up people.

Why all the hate now?

What do you think? Seriously take a look at some pictures of Charlottesville and try to convince yourself they're upset about the removal of a statue, and have no alterior motives. They're chanting "Blood and soil", "Jews will not replace us" and other hateful garbage while goose stepping through the streets. That's not regional pride.

Why is the removal of the statue happening?

Most view it as a symbol of hatred and oppression. As confirmed by the people who showed up to protest its removal.

Ten years ago, you and yours wouldn't even be thinking of this shit, let alone in a fucking Tom Cruise thread. World has gone to hell.