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Jmac Attack wrote:

Foo wrote:How are they ranking O-lines?

It is amazing how good QB play influences the line play. Anyone looks bad when they are pushing the edge rusher around the pocket and the QB steps back into the pressure, or the QB is not throwing on time.

Lots of variables. Here is one example, as I am at work.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/p ... aign=cjaff

I get a lot of my stuff from Bengals message board. I can't access it at work, but there are better ones out there.

Gotcha. That is grading each play. I always liked PFF.

Foo wrote:How are they ranking O-lines?

It is amazing how good QB play influences the line play. Anyone looks bad when they are pushing the edge rusher around the pocket and the QB steps back into the pressure, or the QB is not throwing on time.

This is Siemian's specialty. Drifting back into the ideal arcs for edge rushers. When he was benched for Osweiler, the sacks decreased.

Foo wrote:

Jmac Attack wrote:

Foo wrote:How are they ranking O-lines?

It is amazing how good QB play influences the line play. Anyone looks bad when they are pushing the edge rusher around the pocket and the QB steps back into the pressure, or the QB is not throwing on time.

Lots of variables. Here is one example, as I am at work.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/p ... aign=cjaff

I get a lot of my stuff from Bengals message board. I can't access it at work, but there are better ones out there.

Gotcha. That is grading each play. I always liked PFF.

Their stats are invaluable, especially for corners and defensive linemen. They struggle most with quantifying the impact of offensive linemen and safeties. But they are 100% objective and the process is legitimate. It is serious work.

Siemian's specialty is being great enough behind this o-line to make naive folks thinks it's all his fault. Lol

I'll never get why it's so fashionable to blame the QB. Let's all stream a Denver game and analyze each play purselves instead of looking at some phony internet grading stat system. Would be much better.

I've seen every snap, thanks to Game Pass. Siemian was the problem. Drifts far back in the pocket, slow in his reads, below average arm strength, throws off his back foot. He sucks and makes a bad line look worse.

Jason wrote:I'll never get why it's so fashionable to blame the QB. Let's all stream a Denver game and analyze each play purselves instead of looking at some phony internet grading stat system. Would be much better.

You had a pretty favorable view of PFF the last time they were discussed. What changed?

I generally favor them above all the other stat-based places, nothing beats watching the play. Creating a system for ranking is counter-productive. I don't see a problem with Siemian for two reasons. 1, the line always looks like it's playing against L.T. and Derrick Thomas. 1/10 plays they will give Siemian time, and he's generally always money. 2, he has made errors that are fully his fault. Not every single bad play is the fault of the o-line, but playing under a consistent line will do wonders for a QBs confidence and performance. We've never seen Siemian under anything better than a bad o-line and he's still shined in many games. I'll always give him the benefit of the doubt in this regard.

Headhunter wrote:

Foo wrote:

Jmac Attack wrote:

Foo wrote:How are they ranking O-lines?

It is amazing how good QB play influences the line play. Anyone looks bad when they are pushing the edge rusher around the pocket and the QB steps back into the pressure, or the QB is not throwing on time.

Lots of variables. Here is one example, as I am at work.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/p ... aign=cjaff

I get a lot of my stuff from Bengals message board. I can't access it at work, but there are better ones out there.

Gotcha. That is grading each play. I always liked PFF.

Their stats are invaluable, especially for corners and defensive linemen. They struggle most with quantifying the impact of offensive linemen and safeties. But they are 100% objective and the process is legitimate. It is serious work.

The major flaw is simply that they do not know a player's responsibility on a given play. Sometimes things can look bad but they are the result of someone else not being there to help. I always think about DBs playing zone coverage and some idiot thinks they are getting beat deep or on a crossing route when it is someone else's fault entirely.

Jason wrote:I generally favor them above all the other stat-based places, nothing beats watching the play. Creating a system for ranking is counter-productive. I don't see a problem with Siemian for two reasons. 1, the line always looks like it's playing against L.T. and Derrick Thomas. 1/10 plays they will give Siemian time, and he's generally always money. 2, he has made errors that are fully his fault. Not every single bad play is the fault of the o-line, but playing under a consistent line will do wonders for a QBs confidence and performance. We've never seen Siemian under anything better than a bad o-line and he's still shined in many games. I'll always give him the benefit of the doubt in this regard.

The bottom line is this: Do you feel comfortable that he is capable of becoming a top five QB in the league? Because that is what it takes to win Super Bowls now.

It is a big commitment. If you end up with a top 5 pick, you can't blow that. If a franchise QB is there and you pass, it could mean a long time in purgatory.

A QB not even in the top ten has five ringz.

Siemian has had like three good games in his career and has mostly been horseshit. This is an incredibly bizarre hill to die on. Even Kyle Orton was better.

Foo wrote:

Jason wrote:I generally favor them above all the other stat-based places, nothing beats watching the play. Creating a system for ranking is counter-productive. I don't see a problem with Siemian for two reasons. 1, the line always looks like it's playing against L.T. and Derrick Thomas. 1/10 plays they will give Siemian time, and he's generally always money. 2, he has made errors that are fully his fault. Not every single bad play is the fault of the o-line, but playing under a consistent line will do wonders for a QBs confidence and performance. We've never seen Siemian under anything better than a bad o-line and he's still shined in many games. I'll always give him the benefit of the doubt in this regard.

The bottom line is this: Do you feel comfortable that he is capable of becoming a top five QB in the league? Because that is what it takes to win Super Bowls now.

It is a big commitment. If you end up with a top 5 pick, you can't blow that. If a franchise QB is there and you pass, it could mean a long time in purgatory.

Jason and Siemian's parents are the only people who think he could even be a top 25 QB. He has all the physical limitations of a game manager but also has horrible pocket presence and makes stupid decisions constantly. Dude flat out sucks.

Pocket presence behind this o-line = sack

Too bad he has none.

Shouldn't wish death on a good kid.

Jason wrote:A QB not even in the top ten has five ringz.

Gonna go out on a limb here and say your guy probably makes as many mistakes in a bad game as Brady makes in a good season.

Hate when the offensive line throws pick 6's.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rm8ksjywFhY

Foo wrote:

Jason wrote:A QB not even in the top ten has five ringz.

Gonna go out on a limb here and say your guy probably makes as many mistakes in a bad game as Brady makes in a good season.

Pretty close. Won't argue it. Siemian would have five rings with New England too, so that is pretty irrelevant, though.

lmao omg